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Was ist Wissen (Aparokshanubhuti)

A spiritual discourse on the nature of knowledge, the self (Ātman), and the body.

"Knowledge is pure, immovable, and endless. Ātman itself is knowledge."

"How can it be that you do not recognize this Ātman? ... If you do that, then you are truly an ignorant person or a fool."

The speaker delivers a teaching on distinguishing the eternal, unchanging Ātman from the temporary, changing physical body. Using the words of Śaṅkarācārya, they explain that the Self is pure consciousness—unborn, immortal, and limitless—while the body is bound by birth, growth, and death. The talk cautions against falsely identifying with the body, which leads to suffering, and urges meditation on the Ātman to realize one's true nature as non-dual awareness.

Filming location: Vienna, Austria

After so many stories, we have previously spoken about what knowledge looks like. What is knowledge? We always talk about knowledge. What does knowledge look like? Does knowledge have a measure? Does knowledge have a weight? Is knowledge connected with time? Does your knowledge have form? What is the nature of your knowledge? For example, if we have no knowledge of driving a car, then after practicing for a few weeks or months, we gain the knowledge that we can now drive a car. What has changed in your physical matters? Do you feel heavier now or lighter? Have you become bigger or smaller? What is happening now in your consciousness that you can suddenly drive? And so, knowledge, when one realizes knowledge, then your material body, your existence, according to nature, always remains the same. Kāya has its dharma: birth, growth, and death. These are the three dharmas of kāya: birth, growth, and death. And what we otherwise accept, that is the dharma of nature. But knowledge does not change like that. Knowledge is something entirely different. Knowledge has a beginning where our ignorance is, where we step into knowledge. Our knowledge also grows. More and more you know, you are becoming wiser and wiser. But your knowledge does not change anything. It is unchanging. Unless one loses their memory, unless one falls ill. Something happens only with the body. But knowledge is always present. Knowledge cannot be compared to the body. And so Śaṅkarācārya said before: Nirmalo’ham, I am nirmala, pure. There is no impurity; knowledge is always pure. Nirmalo nityala, nityala, immovable. Knowledge is immovable. It is pure, immovable; here, it always means to be present. Niccalo’nantaḥ, and anantaḥ—anta means end, boundary; ananta means endless. Knowledge is pure, knowledge is immovable, and knowledge is endless. I am nirmala, nityala, ananta, śuddho. And therefore I am completely pure, śuddha, aśuddha, nirmala and mala. I am pure, the knowledge, the Ātman. Ātman itself is knowledge. The ātman is pure, immovable, unlimited, without beginning, end, or middle. And that is I, the pure consciousness. Śuddho’ham ajaro’maraḥ. I am this Śuddhātman, pure Ātman. Ajaro’maraḥ. Unborn, I am nothing. And amara is deathless, immortal. Ātman is unborn, immortal, pure, unlimited, immovable, clarity. This is the Ātman. Na’haṁ deho yasya rūpaḥ. And therefore I can say that I am not this body, this form, this form that stands before me in the mirrors, that I can touch, what I can feel, what I can measure, weigh, everything. This body has a birth, and this body undergoes change. This body is flexible. Change means movement. This body is limited and mortal. It will die. Do not compare your breath with this matter, with this body. And so the knowers, the jñānīs, who declare, who say, I am the Ātman and nothing else, this is the body. Buddha, Buddha means Buddha, is his intellect, his knowledge completely pure; the knower, the wise one is the Buddha. And so he arrives at the jñānapadeśa. In this kṣetra, which you call the human kṣetra, the śāśvata, the Ātman, the eternal Ātman, dwells or is present in your body. Although this body, your ātman, is inside. Why do you say that it is a śūnya rūpa, that there is nothing at all? There are some people who say there is no soul at all, that it is nothing. Death is dead and finished. So this body contains nothing at all. These are all empty spaces, cluttered, knots, and so on. No, in this body there is the beautiful, immortal, divine Self-ātman. Pure, eternal, unchanging, immortal. How can it be, how is it that you do not recognize this Ātman? Or that you have realized or accepted nothing, and you bind yourself only with the body. If you do that, then you are truly an ignorant person or a fool. You are the foolish ones. Such people have great difficulty perceiving reality. To realize reality is a great, arduous task, because you think that way. You cannot possess this knowledge if you think like that. Either you overcome that and enter into your breath, or do you remain in this body? So do not compare anything, your breathing and your body in unity. If you compare your body and your Self, then there is no greater error than what you currently have at this moment. And thus, comparison brings ignorance and sorrow. Compare nothing. Do not compare your body with what I am. Under no circumstances should you say, I am this. It is my body, but I am a breather. Those who are the dehātīta, who stand beyond the body, have difficulty realizing this. Śuddha svarūpa, whose sattva is pure, whose svarūpa is completely pure. Ātman puruṣa śruti yukti pramāṇa sarvāṅga. And therefore listen, listen to your inner Self, the Ātman. What is also said in the Śruti, the sacred scriptures, listen to that and focus on your Ātman there. How long will you keep your body? How long will you keep your body healthier? You can try thousands of things. Every second, your body grows older. Every day your body grows older. Every year is a lost year for your body. It grows old and older. Accept that. And do not waste time. Take your time. Breathe pain. Center your breath. Think, who am I? I am an Ātman, ātmacintan. I am renowned by the word. I am renowned by the word, yet I alone remain beyond it. The essence of selfhood is unity. How can it be attained otherwise? I am, I exist. I am the Śabda. Nāda, sound, resonance. I am the Ātman, known in Śabda as sound. Nāda, rūpa, paro, brahma. I am this Śabda. Sound, Oṁ. Oṁ is Ātman. Ātman is Oṁ. Everything comes from above. Everything exists in above. And everything ends in above. Sound, tone. Tone is the breath. When we speak, when this sound radiates from our body, that is the vibration, the sound of the ātman. It is a breath that rings, speaks, or vibrates. And when the breath is no longer bound to the body in the breath, then the sound is no longer there. The sound is gone. If there is a crack in a vase, then no sound remains. It sounds broken. The sound binds. And so says: Śabda-jñānaṁ yasya martyaṁ heli, oṁ āvedayāmi dharmāya heli. Those who know this word, this sound, they are my relatives. Nothing is my physical, bodily kinship. This is only transient. It is bound by time. In every life, we have had a father and a mother. In every life, we have had siblings. In every life, you have had a man or a woman. But you have not yet had this knowledge. This knowledge, the Brahman, the master of Gurudeva, that you receive, is unique. And if you still have doubts in this transformation and compare yourself again with other things, then there is no other ignorant or stranger than yourself. And therefore, Śabda, this Ātman, ahaṁ śabdena vikhyātā, eka eva sthitapara. I am, I am known as the Sound, I am known as the Resonance, I, only Unity, pure Stillness, and I am immovable within myself. There is no motion. There are no emotions, there are no changes, there is no despair, there is no comparison. Nothing and no thing can you compare with the Self. And when you begin to compare, then you are separated from the breathing. And of course, there is plenty to compare in the material world. And therefore there is enough trouble. And therefore there is enough suffering. And there is enough sadness and states of inner misery. And therefore, I as this Ātman, the Śabda, eka-mātra, the One and Only, that is Ātman. That means the ātman is not a bundle of many qualities. Everything else has qualities, attributes, guṇas, many, many other functions. But the Ātman is pure and unique. There are no two qualities in the Ātman. It is only one, unity, ekatā. Should one try to be ekatā? The name alone is not enough. Ekatā means unity, there is nothing more to it. But the mind is like a monkey, jumping from one window to another window. And it is said that a monkey is naturally very restless. And now a scorpion comes and stings her from behind. And the monkey becomes a thousand times more restless, jumping back and forth. And this scorpion is a vṛtti. What is a vṛtti? A thought. And suddenly a thought arises, and then this thought searches for something and compares something. I do not have that, but I want to have it. Then the search begins. And when you find something and believe, now I have found it, suddenly you become dissatisfied and compare it with something else and with your own feelings. I am also not satisfied here. And then the search begins again. And therefore, Śaṅkarācārya said, the Ātman cannot be compared to anything. Ātman has no bundle of qualities. Ātman is Ātman. Truth is Truth. Fire is Fire. No matter in which form. Water is water. No matter in which form. So, light is light. Whether it is a small light, an oil lamp, or sunlight. Light is light. And so, ātman is ātman. And this body, which has many forms, emotions, many states, many feelings, many qualities, attributes. This body is a bundle of many desires, qualities, emotions, and so on. Therefore, Śaṅkarācārya said, how can it be that body, matter, and breath are one? How can you compare that which is one? It is not one; it is a difference. And thus recognize unity, non-dualism. And Non-Dualism means, recognize the unity as Ātman. See no difference in Ātman. Difference and suffering, and knowledge and pain, exist only in your physical planes. And the physical plane, of course, cannot be one. It is a different quality. I am the seer, the perfected one; the body is seen, standing there. How can one say "This is mine," as the body is not truly ours? I am perfected as draṣṭā rūpeṇa. I am the dṛṣṭi, the sākṣī. Dṛṣṭi, draṣṭā, draṣṭā means the seer, the witness. You are a witness to what is called the ātman. You are the witness of what belongs to the body. You see, the body and the breath cannot be one. And so it is, you are the knower or you are the witness. And it is already clear that body and breath cannot be one. You always say, and it is true, it is my body. As soon as you say that it is my body, Śaṅkarācārya says, it is very clear, it is absolutely, absolutely clear that you are nothing of that. This is your body. And therefore, do not suffer, do not be sad about the condition of your body. Young or old, healthy or ill, tall or short, overweight or underweight. It is the body, let it be. Give him freedom. That is it, but it is not easy. Unfortunately, it is not easy. As long as we live, we will give up nothing. No matter, Śaṅkarācārya, who says who is who. Right after the lecture, we begin to think and do something different. Nothing is simple. On the other hand, it is advisable that we take care of our body, that we own our body, because this body is a very valuable tool for us. And this human existence with a healthy body and a healthy mind or consciousness is very important for the whole world, very important for everyone. Your existence is more valuable and important to others than to yourself. Others need you more than you need yourself. Your body, because you work, your healthy, sacred spirit within your body, which acts in this world, is very significant. But do not compare yourself to being this body. The moment you think about your body, you become sad. Either you will have ego. Either you have ego or you are sad, because 30 years ago your body was completely different than it is now. Why are you sad now? Because you compare your body with how it was 30 years ago. And it cannot be the same as it was 30 years ago. Right? This is that. And that is this. So, therefore, the Śaṅkarācārya said again, tell me then, how can this body be Puruṣa? Puruṣa is a general term; it has multiple meanings. Puruṣa means masculine. Puruṣa here now means Ātman. The ātman has no attribute. It is neither feminine nor masculine. The differences exist only in the body. Ātman is different. And therefore Śaṅkarācārya said, this body cannot be Puruṣa. Puruṣa is Ātman. And he is perfect. There, for Ātman, there is no mother and no father. For Ātman, there is no ease, young or old. Ātman has no beginning and no end. Ātman is neither sick nor healthy. It stands above this dualism. Ātman is simply bliss, Ānanda. An absolute state in which you constantly experience the most beautiful feeling, without any change. Then you are in this breath. Breathe in. When you meditate, people say, oh, he is truly meditating so deeply, that is completely ātmalīna. That has become one with itself. You can see that when you meditate. And if you do not see, then I can tell you how. View of the eyebrow center of this person. Then either the eyebrow center sees them together or is tense or moving. Every little vṛtti causes a movement in your eyebrow center. And when you lie in breathing, when you are one with your breath, then it is the state of Samādhi. Ātmalīna also means that when you give up your body and then you let go, you say Hari Oṁ, death, physical death. Ātmalīna, you are united with the breathers. A word says, "Ātmalīna ho gaye," is already dead, dead and has entered Samādhi. To become one again in the breath—that is our goal. Our goal is that afterwards, when we have completed our task in this world and eventually depart from the body, no matter how—it could be an accident, an incident—one never knows. There are several occasions when we will leave our body. Then in the end, it is important that we unite in the breath, that we have this awareness. Otherwise, the soul wanders again through various planes, what one calls purgatory or heaven or cave or this or that and the other. This whole torment, even with the body, one continues to torment oneself still. So Śaṅkarācārya says, it is unnecessary. Why do you torment yourself even after death? Realize that. Now realize yourself. Now prepare yourself, concentrate. The end of your life, your consciousness, will be this divine breath living. The breath does not unite in the breath. A flame is burning, and we blow it out. Where is the flame? Gone. That has become one in the space. You cannot catch again, you can only seek. You can ignite once again and create a flame. The breath has already become one with the breath. It was the form that had become formless. If it were a form, then you could see it, but there is no form there. Previously, the flame was sustained by oxygen and the substances and the fire. It shone, and there you separated from these elements. And again, what shone has already disappeared. There is wax there, fire is there, air is there, but it is already separated. This is the Ātman. How then can this body be a Puruṣa? How can this body be compared to the Ātman? One should not. There is a story about Mīrā, the saintly Mīrā, who wished to meet Tulsīdāsa. And she went there and sent a message to Tulsīdāsa that Mīrā was coming and would like to have his darśana. Darśana means to see him. And Tulsīdāsa has the face of a messenger, as Tulsīdāsa does not see women. He did not even want to see a woman’s face. Such were the times. And sometimes in life, it happens that I have had enough, truly no more. And Tulsīdāsa saw messages, and Mīrā saw messages back again. She said, I thought there is only one Puruṣa as the ātman. Who is the second Puruṣa, I would like to see him. And when he received this wise answer, he walked barefoot and greeted Mīrā, touching her feet. So it is. Puruṣa, the complete Puruṣa is Ātman. Puruṣottama, Kṛṣṇa as Puruṣottama. Bhagavān Rāma, Mārīcā Puruṣottama Rāma. Uttama means the best. The best in the Puruṣa in human life, the Supreme. Incarnation. Kṛṣṇa was a human, Rāma was a human, Buddha is a human. All divine incarnations were human, in a human body. But the best in all. So this Puruṣa here is the Ātman. Recognize your Ātman. Engage with your Ātman. Occupy your thoughts with your Ātman. Do not compare anything. Your feeling and your sadness, who said what and why it was said that way, surely have a meaning, but I do not know what kind of meaning that is. These are meaningless thoughts. Either you know or you do not know, that is all. If you do not know the purpose, then why waste time? Accept, okay, may it be so or so. I am a Puruṣa. I am, I am,... without illness. Breath is not sick. The deha, śarīra, the body, is sick. Vikāra, vikāra is in the body all kinds of diseases, various things, they become sick one day, maybe not yet, but they will. This body is full of vikāra, of flesh, of bones, of fluids, of feces, of urine, of mucus. So many things. Often I say to dear God, thank you for having clothed it in such beautiful skin. The dear God has adorned it with such beautiful skin. And sometimes people are dissatisfied, and then over this skin that God has given, we put on revealing clothes. And we try on this clothing even further. So, the body is full of vikāra. They will rot for a day, they will become ill, they will change, it will be destroyed. And as long as the breath is not trapped inside the body, it remains somewhat healthy and so on. As soon as the body is no longer bound to the breath, it decays so quickly. And when the human body begins to decay, it is the fastest to start smelling, like rotten eggs. The egg is the fastest to start smelling, or a fish. So this body is a vikāra, full of vikāras. And the breath is the substitute. The Ātman does not have this defect. Beauty, purity, clarity, unity, that is Ātman. Therefore, meditate, always meditate on the Ātman. Repeat your mantra. Your mantra will guide your consciousness, your mind in the right direction. Always direct your feelings towards the Ātman and not towards the body. I am vikārahīna, you have vikārahīna. Therefore I am vikārahīna. The Ātman, myself, is not vikāra. The body is always vikāravān. And the body is always full of vikāra. Vikāra can be in the body, and Vikāra can also be in your mind. Yes, some, Lord Vikāra, sick thoughts, negative thoughts, these are all full of Vikāra. You say, why are you suddenly thinking of this person like this now? The other says, because there is so much vikāra within. And from where did this person receive Vikāra? Through kuṣaṅga. And which kuṣaṅga? Perhaps with oneself as well. Your own inner arguments, your own thoughts, what you constantly compare, this and that, do I like this, do I not like that. And that causes so much vikāra in your body, so much vikāra in your thoughts, so much vikāra in your consciousness. It stinks. Negative thoughts are full of vikāra. Ātman is nothing. Viveka is nothing. Vikāra is gone. That is completely pure. I am the unchanging; the body is ever changing. Thus it is understood: which person is the witness of what? So, I am Vikāra-hīna, without Vikāra. And the body is full of Vikāra. That is quite clear, Śaṅkarācārya said. It is a very clear example, he says. Then please tell me, how is it possible, how can it be, that the Ātman and the body are one. Come to Non-Dualism, come to the Ātman. And you cannot compare these two things. If you compare the two things, then you do not know what reality is. You have not yet attained realization. Perhaps in the next lives, perhaps in three or four lives, perhaps in 200 lives, or perhaps in 200 million years. But the end of your journey is when you have realized that. And it is a golden opportunity, especially when you have just been born as a human and live in a human body. Therefore, do not quarrel over culture, religions, race, or nations. Everything, that is an illusion. Do not cause dualism in the mind of the person. Do not cause any doubt in the mind of the person. Also lead us, Asato mā sad gamaya, Tamaso mā jyotir gamaya, Mṛtyor mā amṛtaṁ gamaya. Also Veda Mantra, Sarve bhavantu sukhinaḥ, may all be happy. But how can all be happy? One makes a distinction, despair. Eko brahma dvitīyo nāsti. The Brahman-Ātman is only one. There is only One, who is immortal and everlasting. The third nāsti, where there are two, there is change, there is death. And therefore Śaṅkarācārya said, it is quite clear that this body cannot be the Ātman. This body is mortal, and Ātman is immortal. And so, we will begin, or rather, we must begin to think in this way. The knowledgeable, the wise, the intelligent persons have these qualities, or I would say not just qualities, have spoken about Ātman, what Ātman is. That is also the Śruti. Śruti is that which is transmitted from the master to the disciple, from the master to the disciple through hearing. The teaching is only through listening. And Śruti is that which the student has heard from the master, remembered, and passed on. With all of this, they have established the result of it all, the essence of the entire Śruti, Smṛti, and so forth, which is that there is a difference between Ātman and Anātman. And it would be good for everyone who comes in to please definitely endure this little game. Śravaṇaṁ puruṣa eveti śuktaṁ puruṣa saṅgītam apy ucyate yathāha śrutayaḥ kathaṁ syād ekaṁ puruṣam. Śaṅkarācāryajī said, in Śruti and Puruṣasūkta it is also said that everything that exists is the Puruṣa. All that is, all that exists, is the Puruṣa and nothing of this kṣetra. How then can this body be pure? How can this body be the Self? How can this body be the breather? The body is nothing of that sort. It is your error, it is your attachment, it is your dependence, it is your false identity, it is your false perception in your life. What you suffer is your error. Neither liberation nor bondage, neither mother nor birth, neither father nor kin, the form of cidānanda, I am Śivo’ham, I am Śivo’ham. Victory to the Enlightened Bhagavān.

This text is transcribed and grammar corrected by AI. If in doubt what was actually said in the recording, use the transcript to double click the desired cue. This will position the recording in most cases just before the sentence is uttered.

The text contains hyperlinks in bold to three authoritative books on yoga, written by humans, to clarify the context of the lecture:

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